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FSFlyingSchool Developer
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Hi:
I'd certainly like to see them - please be sure to record the landing at it occurs, so that we can hear what the instructor is saying AND please send the log book page showing all the landing details too.
The runway and weather conditions will of course need to be the same, as will the aircraft.
Jeff Preston ('Squadron Leader') - FSFlyingSchool Publisher & Lead Developer
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FSFlyingSchool Captain
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Last Login: Friday, September 16, 2022 2:41:38 AM
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Hello,
Thank you for accepting to check some landings. The 2 videos have been done with FSX. Landing score is not very good but much better than those I get generally with X-Plane (in exactly the same flight conditions). Concerning this flight I don't understand why the alignment during descent is 0 %. I agree with other comments except as usual those about taxiing turns (perhaps I have to do some adjustment with my SAITEK X52) and also about the comment concerning flaps.
Thank you again.
Best regards
gerodcray
PS:
Inside cockpit
https://youtu.be/h7N43HRqtOE
Outside cockpit
https://youtu.be/HFpSjSYluDs
Logbook
LightSpeed piloting Carenado C172SP Skyhawk G1000 BLANK ended Sunday, March 18, 2018 at 10:48
FSFlyingSchool Pro 2016 (September 2 2016)
Using: FSX
Visibility: 62.14 Miles Wind: 0 Knots
Aircraft: CESSNA ID: Airline: Flight:
Flight plan: LFLE TO LFLB Chambery:Aix-les-Bains NAV1: CY
Failure(s): None at landing
Failure Event(s) (Zulu Time): None
Failure Bonus:0% Flight Duration:00 Hours 07 Mins 04 Secs
Landing Score:68.59
Landing was successful in the following areas:
Good glideslope on visual approach. [80%]
Gentle touchdown. [174 FPM]
Good landing speed - not too fast. [48 KIAS]
Wings were level.
Distance from runway threshold (visual approach): [245 feet]
Landed on runway surface.
Glideslope held until flare.
Good pitch control after touchdown.
Good pitch at landing. [4 degrees]
With flaps - good job. [20 degrees]
Heading aligned with runway.
Throttle(s) idle.
Good controlled final descent to touchdown.
Landing included the following problems:
Poor alignment with runway on visual approach - line up and stay there. [0%]
Poor steering after landing - stay on the centre line.
Definite room for improvement...
Flight Score:94.42
Flight commended in the following areas:
Smooth turns.
Nice banking.
Correct matching of flaps to speeds.
Comfortable G forces.
Smooth pitch control.
Flown within aircraft's maximum speed limit.
Good take off steering.
Rotation was not late.
Safe taxi speed.
Smooth braking during taxi.
Smooth climb during takeoff.
Wings level near ground.
Well coordinated turns.
No stalls.
No flying dangerously close to stall speed.
Smooth comfortable descent rate.
Pitch not too high.
Pitch not too low.
Approach speed not too fast.
Low altitude speeds not too fast.
Good clearance of obstacles.
Flight included the following problems:
Dangerous taxiing turns - these cause discomfort and stress.
Flaps not down on time - plan your landing next time.
Definite room for improvement...
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FSFlyingSchool Developer
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Hi:
Thanks for the movies! I love the scenery.
NOTE to all readers.
In the movie the pilot has FSFlyingSchool 'help' turned on and so the instructor is talking a lot - this is of course very handy but rest assured that all its component parts can be selectively turned off as the pilot desires.
>> Concerning this flight I don't understand why the alignment during descent is 0 %.
I can see that the aircraft is to the left of center for the entire approach and the instructor directs the pilot's attention to this throughout the approach - this is the reason.
>> I agree with other comments except as usual those about taxiing turns (perhaps I have to do some adjustment with my SAITEK X52) and also about the comment concerning flaps.
The aircraft moves across the center line just before touchdown and then moves to the left, with a noticeable roll (listing) to starboard as this is done - this is what the instructor cites as "Poor steering after landing." The instructor wants the best from the pilot and this includes landing on the center line (ideally) and staying on it.
I cannot comment on the log entries:
"Dangerous taxiing turns - these cause discomfort and stress.
Flaps not down on time - plan your landing next time."
as these events occurred before the period recorded in the video.
Getting back to your original point, it would be useful to be able to compare both a landing in FSX and a landing in XP that the instructor classed as "A splendid landing" (which is what he/she logs for the landing if it has no faults) as that way we can see if the score is noticeably lower for no apparent reason.
Jeff Preston ('Squadron Leader') - FSFlyingSchool Publisher & Lead Developer
FSFlyingSchool 2023 for Microsoft Flight Simulator
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FSFlyingSchool Captain
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Last Login: Friday, September 16, 2022 2:41:38 AM
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Hello
Thank you for comments.
The job is now to get ‘a splendid landing’ both in XP and FSX/P3D and to compare scores. It may take some days ! I’ll try and I’ll send videos.
Concerning the previous flight I have two remarks:
- A few seconds before landing there was the message ‘you are not aligned’. On the video it can be seen that the plane is just in front of the runway. I was surprised;
- The comment ‘flaps not down in time’ cannot be a consequence of the speed. The outside video shows the time of the first 'flaps down' and the speed shown in the inside video at approximately the same time is lower than 90 kts. Then why this comment ? Perhaps this would have been done just after the TOD.
Best regards
gerodcray
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FSFlyingSchool Developer
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Hi:
>> A few seconds before landing there was the message ‘you are not aligned’. On the video it can be seen that the plane is just in front of the runway. I was surprised
I believe the last time the instructor talks about lateral alignment is at 3:03 at which point the pilot is aligned straight down the left hand side of the runway, but not with the center line, and this is what makes the difference.
>> The comment ‘flaps not down in time’ cannot be a consequence of the speed. The outside video shows the time of the first 'flaps down' and the speed shown in the inside video at approximately the same time is lower than 90 kts. Then why this comment ? Perhaps this would have been done just after the TOD.
The log will say this if the instructor has said "Lower flaps if you intend to land." which is said if you are in landing mode and slow enough to lower flaps and you have flaps and they have not been lowered at all.
Jeff Preston ('Squadron Leader') - FSFlyingSchool Publisher & Lead Developer
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FSFlyingSchool USA for Microsoft Flight Simulator
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FS Instant Approach for Microsoft Flight Simulator
FS Instant Help for FSX, FS2004
Winner of 5 consecutive PC Pilot Magazine 'Classic Product' Awards
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FSFlyingSchool Captain
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Hello,
OK for the comment concerning the flaps. But the last message relative to the alignment was at 2.44 and at that time I don't know what could have been done to be best aligned.
Best regards
gerodcray
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FSFlyingSchool Developer
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Hi:
Yes - there is a comment at 2:44 and also at 3:03 and the pilot is pointing down the left half of the runway, not the center; so as we may imagine, this is what the instructor is talking about.
Jeff Preston ('Squadron Leader') - FSFlyingSchool Publisher & Lead Developer
FSFlyingSchool 2023 for Microsoft Flight Simulator
FSFlyingSchool 2023 for X-Plane 12 & 11
FS Instant Approach 2023 for X-Plane 12 & 11 (Windows)
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FSFlyingSchool PRO 2019 FSX, FSX-SE, FS2004
FSFlyingSchool USA for Microsoft Flight Simulator
FS Instant Approach 2019 for X-Plane 11 (Mac)
FS Instant Approach for Microsoft Flight Simulator
FS Instant Help for FSX, FS2004
Winner of 5 consecutive PC Pilot Magazine 'Classic Product' Awards
Fly like the Pros with X-Plane, Flight Simulator and Prepar3D!
If you wish to unsubscribe simply reply to email with the word UNSUBSCRIBE in the SUBJECT line.
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FSFlyingSchool Captain
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Hello,
It will take a while to record flight videos having the comment 'A spendid landing'. Before achieving this I searched in my full logbooks and I noticed that for some splendid landings I got (not many but some) the results are in the range 60-70 for XP10&11 and 80-90 for FSX/P3D (obviously with the same plane (c172) and under the same conditions). The variability is mostly a consequence of differences between percentages relative to glide slope and alignment.
Best regards and thank you again for explaining.
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FSFlyingSchool Captain
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Last Login: Friday, September 16, 2022 2:41:38 AM
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Hello,
I do not still understand the relevance of the comments of the instructor. Only two examples : in phase of landing unless 500 feet AGL I’m asked to have the gear up or at a speed lower than 70 knots I’m informed that this speed is too high for having flaps down.
In the last example of the video (link below) the feeling is different : the final comment is "a splendid landing " but I did not have the impression that this landing was really so good. The score is about 30 as it is the case for a poor landing with a light GA aircraft. I guess you can explain me and thank you again for analysing.
Best regards.
gerodcray
The video flight :
https://youtu.be/P2Wo7aURYeI
The corresponding FSFS Logbook
LightSpeed piloting Cirrus SF-50 ended Sunday, April 15, 2018 at 10:23
FSFlyingSchool 2018 for X-Plane 11 and 10 (December 18 2017)
Using: X-Plane
Visibility: 25.00 Miles Wind: 0 Knots
Flight plan: LSGK TO LSTS :St Stephan NAV1: ---
Flight Duration:00 Hours 06 Mins 14 Secs
Landing Score:30.79
Landing was successful in the following areas:
Good glideslope on visual approach. [70%]
Good alignment with runway on visual approach. [80%]
Gentle touchdown. [692 FPM]
Good landing speed - not too fast. [66 KIAS]
Wings were level.
Distance from runway threshold (visual approach): [464 feet]
Landed on runway surface.
Glideslope held until flare.
Good pitch control after touchdown.
Good pitch at landing.
Heading aligned with runway.
Throttle(s) idle.
Good controlled final descent to touchdown.
Good steering after landing.
A splendid landing!
Flight Score:98.82
Flight commended in the following areas:
Smooth turns.
Gear deployment at safe speed.
Comfortable G forces.
Smooth pitch control.
Flown within aircraft's maximum speed limit.
Gentle taxi turns.
Good take off steering.
Rotation was not late.
Safe taxi speed.
Smooth braking during taxi.
Smooth climb during takeoff.
Wings level near ground.
Well coordinated turns.
No stalls.
Smooth comfortable descent rate.
Pitch not too high.
Pitch not too low.
Approach speed not too fast.
Good clearance of obstacles.
Flight included the following problems:
Steep banking - save your aerobatic flying for some other time.
Airspeed too low - you are risking stalls.
Excessive speed at low altitude - several complaints have been filed.
Definite room for improvement...
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FSFlyingSchool Developer
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Last Login: 2 days ago @ 4:09:25 AM
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Hi:
>> I do not still understand the relevance of the comments of the instructor. Only two examples : in phase of landing unless 500 feet AGL I’m asked to have the gear up
There's certainly nothing in the program which asks for the gear to be kept up until under 500 AGL when in landing mode. The most likely reason is that FSFlyingSchool 'landing mode' was not yet engaged in which case the instructor has not been told a landing is planned and the pilot is still cruising.
>> or at a speed lower than 70 knots I’m informed that this speed is too high for having flaps down.
This of course depends on the plane being used. It will also depend on whether the pilot has correctly created data for the plane if it is a plane the pilot added.
Which plane are you talking about?
What are the flap settings and their speeds?
What flap setting triggered the comment?
>> In the last example of the video (link below) the feeling is different : the final comment is "a splendid landing " but I did not have the impression that this landing was really so good. The score is about 30 as it is the case for a poor landing with a light GA aircraft. I guess you can explain me and thank you again for analysing.
We've considered changing the wording of that phrase. It really means "Your landing included no large faults." although it may have contained many minor faults - and this one did, including the ratings for vertical and horizontal alignment and a vertical speed which would preferably be considerably lower.
Jeff Preston ('Squadron Leader') - FSFlyingSchool Publisher & Lead Developer
FSFlyingSchool 2023 for Microsoft Flight Simulator
FSFlyingSchool 2023 for X-Plane 12 & 11
FS Instant Approach 2023 for X-Plane 12 & 11 (Windows)
FSFlyingSchool PRO 2020 Prepar3D v 5
FSFlyingSchool PRO 2019 FSX, FSX-SE, FS2004
FSFlyingSchool USA for Microsoft Flight Simulator
FS Instant Approach 2019 for X-Plane 11 (Mac)
FS Instant Approach for Microsoft Flight Simulator
FS Instant Help for FSX, FS2004
Winner of 5 consecutive PC Pilot Magazine 'Classic Product' Awards
Fly like the Pros with X-Plane, Flight Simulator and Prepar3D!
If you wish to unsubscribe simply reply to email with the word UNSUBSCRIBE in the SUBJECT line.
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